Nature vs. Nurture

Well, you may have heard something of this debate in a psychology class or science class. However, let's bring it into the Church. We have discussed our environment, in terms of the media - the influence that the popular culture has on our mindsets. The way we think and act is heavily nurtured, by culture, to be self-centered, materialistic, jaded, etc... Now, we must look through the opposite end of the microscope:

If our mindsets are not what popular culture dictates, then what are we supposed to base our decisions on? How are we supposed to think? What qualifies a man as a man and a woman as a woman?

Obviously "the Bible" is the textbook, right answer. However, there is more to it than this simple answer. What does the Bible actually say? We are not just in the circumstance of having behavioral problems that we need to correct. We have fatal flaws in our nature that must be healed over time and were already justified by Christ's death. So, what do we do now?

Four points of interest with this subject:

1. We were created as beings in the IMAGE OF GOD! - what does this mean?
2. We are supposed to be living dead before salvation, if we accept that salvation is new life. - say what?
3. We need other Christians to live as the Bible dictates. - why can't we do it alone?
4. There is always new life in Christ. - so do you continually go back to the living dead and get re-saved? when do we know that we are at "the place" we are supposed to be at? What level is good enough?

Well, as the topics are fresh in my mind, here is the account of the evening:

We shared food and drink, discussed present life blessings and crises, requested prayer for various reasons, and shared our views on God, His works, and temptations we are facing.

I would not call it a night of sin, although the meeting took place in a bar. And Jacob's Field had a fireworks show after the game - a bonus - this shot shows the way you can see it through the window of Flannery's!

Reminder for SATURDAY!!!

Don't forget, Flannery's this Saturday - 7:30 PM sharp.

We'll be near the door to begin with, but we'll make our way to some section of the pub where there are sort of walled in tables - as Curt discribed.

If you wish to cover any particular topics, feel free to share your opinion in the blog.

We will be transitioning to a book in November - so any suggestions for books are also welcome. Last time we went through The Purpose Driven Life, but the expectation was to read outside of the group. This time, since we have three months to cover one book, I am thinking that we will even read portions of the book in the meeting. This way, we are all (literally) on the same page.

What is Permissible vs. What is Beneficial

Well, we have hit the subject in our little chat about sin and freedom, in a roundabout way. Since we are saved by Christ's blood, everything is permissible (Paul talks about everything from NOT getting circumsized to eating meat sacrificed to idols - today that would include hanging out at bars like Jesus hung out with Matthew and his pals). Then there is the flip side - not everything is beneficial.

If it comes down to the fact that we won't go to hell for going to a bar (it is permissible), this may encourage some to hit bars regularly (as this group will do next Saturday). However, if one makes it a regular habit to hang around a bar, it may not be beneficial... Alcoholism is NOT one of the fruits of the Spirit.

Here is the issue to discuss: is there anything that is so un-beneficial that it really should not be done at all? Why, if EVERYTHING is permissible?

An interesting point came up in our last meeting:

Commonly we expect Christians to have this elevated status of purity, faithfulness, and so on. We expect that, because we claim Christ's blood, we definately display the fruit of the Spirit. However, it is becoming increasingly difficult to argue that we are different from the culture in which we live. More "Christians" are divorced than non-Christians, work ethic is often worse with Christians, we cheat and use shortcuts like it is our job, we are as prone (if not more prone) to premarital sex, we steal from work, we gossip, we view pornography in our alone time instead of praying, we do all that we preach against. By no means am I insinuating that every Christian adopts all of the above behaviors, but I am saying that it is easy to find the foresaid amongst even three randomly selected Christians.

And we are NOT talking about those who have honestly repented of the above!

What then are we to do? In the past, Paul suggested leaving people with these ethics out of fellowship... but is this our method now? Do we preach condemnation? Do we continue to give grace for the sin (not the change of heart)? Do we ban such Christ "believers" (not "followers," obviously) from service in the church? Do we sit in a room and pray about it without taking action (prayer with action is normally effective...)? Or do we continue to ignore it and pretend it is not there?

Without a single statistical fact, it has been observed that Christians with these ethics last approximately less than two years in any given church or Christian social club before hopping to the next, where people will not know them, or dropping away from the Church completely. And usually there is a path of destruction left behind.

One might call this exageration, or maybe not... we're interested in hearing other opinions.

Good conversation on Katrina last meeting. It seemed to really impact us in a lot of different and interesting ways.

Prayer Requests:
Josh's leg
Curt's House and Work issues
Jason's next gathering - more control for the fluid flow :)

Proposal: It was suggested by a member that we meet at Flannery's (W. 9th St.) for a night-out meeting, as we did in the past in other locations. The idea is that this location would facilitate conversation well and, as with traditional Irish pubs, it is less prone to idiot-drunks. This would be the September 17th meeting. This would also provide a good oportunity to invite friends, as a bar is often less threatening to those who are less prone to attend a home group.

Comments on any of the following are welcome.

Well, we meet Tomorrow (Saturday - Curt's - 7:30 PM sharp, no pun intended).

Here is a comment space for any issues that you would like to discuss besides those outlined on this web page.